I think that's taking it a bit too far. I think some people think all the SUVs Americans drive is part of the reason they have such a high demand for oil which is why they got involved with Iraq. Then they think terrorists began target America for putting itself about in the Middle East But I don't think it makes any real difference, America would still have a high oil demand even if SUVs didn't exist.

Cars of private people represent only a small percentage of oil consumption.

Wickey, great advice Makes me wish that I had said it

Some do, some don’t. Some take it too far.

As for the one's who try and pass off that SUVs are polluting the Earth, all I have to say is my (Full-Size) SUV is Certified as a "Ultra Low Emissions vehicle", which means it gives off no more emissions than a typical car (Sedan) I do not know about other SUVs though, I would have to do some studying on that.

How on Earth can an enormous Ford Expedition with a 5.4 litre engine get the emissions as a normal sedan (unless it was a big Cadillac or something)? You'd be wasting your time trying to find out whether other SUVs don't pollute more than medium-sized cars (and when I say medium-sized sedan I mean something like a VW Passat not a 4 litre Buick or Chevy), because in general THEY DO. Explorer4x4 used to spend ages going on about the fuel economy of SUVs but his argument held no water, all the factory test results that he quoted were not realistic measurements of the fuel economy SUVs gets when they are driving around on real roads, through real cities instead of some test lab. America's idea of good fuel consumption is about 20-25 mpg, where I come from that's a bit thirsty. But it's alright for Americans to have thirstier cars because they pay half as much for gas as we do.

It doesn't matter anyway, the huge growth in air travel is doing far more harm to the environment than cars.

By the way I just checked out the fuel consumption of your Expedition, it's 14 City, 19 Highway. That is not "ultra-low". Though maybe the actual emmissions are a different matter.

And what's stupid about it is that these anti-terrorists are vandalising suvs becuase they pollute and they destroy them by setting them on fire! What the Heck? Fires help decrease air pollution? "That's what happened with the one attack I mentioned about that took place 4 years ago." Terrorists are idiots!

You would have to understand what kind of engine we are talking about here. This is not your ordinary V8.

The one in my Expedition is a 5.4 Liter 24-Valve SOHC Modular Triton™ V8 with "CVCT" (Continuously Variable Camshaft Timing)

This same Triton ™ V8 is not only offered in the Expedition but also the Ford F-150 Pickup (The truck on which the Expedition is based) and the F-150 is also Certified as an Ultra Low Emission vehicle. Ta Da!

Please note that the intelligent Triton™ V8 with CVCT was only offered until the 2005 model year onward. Any Expedition from the 2004 model year to the 1997 model year had the 2 valve per cylinder setup and no CVCT or special tuning, nor computer hardware to produce high performance. Still, even without those improvements the 2003-On Expedition was most certainly qualified as a Ultra Low Emissions vehicle.

Here is a article by Car & Driver (At the bottom of the article is some evidence that it is a Ultra Low Emissions vehicle) This is why Explorer4x4’s arguments never held up.

http://www.caranddriver.com/previews/1841/2003-ford-expedition.html




You got Emissions standards and Fuel consumption mixed up.
However the Expedition is capable of better fuel economy than what you posted. See my post when I first got the vehicle.

http://forum.imcdb.org/forum_topic-2082-Just_got_back___.html

"ultra low" emissions compared to what? I doubt that these can be as low as a less heavy vehicle that would consume less.

The best explanation I could find was here: ULEV (Ultra Low Emission Vehicle)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra_Low_Emission_Vehicle

They are pretty much based on the same stringent guidelines, as they all have to meet or exceed a certain goal/criteria to be classed as such.

Alright, so it's actually 20 mpg highway and 16 city. Big wow. That's still thirsty, maybe not too bad for such a leviathan car, but I tell you if you lived in England, you would not be happy with a car that only got 16 miles to the gallon around town unless you had plenty of money to burn. Not to mention that the Expedition would be a horrible car to drive around a British town (especially some of the less modernized ones) and to park. So I ask, if you lived in England, what car would you have then? You couldn't have your beloved Expedition unless you wanted to import it (I've never seen any Expeditions over here). Although you could get a Land Cruiser like you used to have, although you said it got half the fuel economy, which I find very suprising.

If I moved to England I would most certainly have to leave my Expedition behind. If I moved to England and had still made the same salary there as I do here, then I would maybe have the Expedition shipped to England (Though I doubt any Ford dealerships in England would be certified to Service an Expedition) I would have to service it myself.



I know the Expedition looks like a Brute, but I assure you it is a gentle giant. With power assisted, Speed sensitive steering; the Expedition will turn around on a Dime (this ability has come in handy when I take it Off-Road) Also the Expedition Limited Edition has Dynamic Park Assist as a standard feature (Dynamic Park Assist is included with the Ultimate Electronics Package) lesser trim levels offer this as an option. So it is not as hard to park as most people think. The Limited’s also have PowerFold™ Heated/Turn Indicator clustered side out-board mirrors that will fold up against the Expedition at the push of a button. (Also good for Off-Road use as the side mirrors on a Expedition are enormous. I can fold them in so as not to have a tree tear them off)



Why so surprising? The Expedition sips on gas compared to that dinosaur devourer. Other than that and the high monthly payments for it, the Land Cruiser was a Ok vehicle, but I doubt I will ever own another one. Plus it did not have near as many Luxury goodies as the Expedition Limited.

This pic was taken one a vacation trip after I stopped to fuel it up: In the Consumption display it shows the LC was getting about 11 miles to the gallon.

It'll then become a collector's item.

well they probbaly use some credo similar to Greenpeace - Kill the beaver, you will save the tree!

Well, you still have to find a big place to put its five meters length

Exactly. Except it's actually 5.2 metres long. And 2 metres wide. And 6'3" tall. Believe me, Neptune, you would not enjoy trying to park it in a British car park (have you ever been to one?). And if you did move to England it just would not be worth importing it, don't forget fuel over here costs at least TWICE as much as it does in America, remember when you complained about how much your Land Cruiser cost to run? Well it would probably be even worse than that. You'd certainly stand out though. Also most people who live in England, especially the south of England, have very little use for SUVs, even less so I think than Americans do, that's why I hate seeing them in my country. The only people who really need them are people like farmers and landowners, most English people only own tiny amounts of land (usually a house and a small garden) and English terrain is generally very mild. This is no real wilderness in England like there is in America, it's too small and most of it is built on. And if you're in somewhere like the Lake District, you tend to leave the car and walk up the hills.

Actually the fuel cost for the Land Cruiser was not the problem. (I just considered the Land Cruiser’s bad gas mileage as being wasteful) If you want to know the real reason why I got rid of it, it was because of the extremely high monthly payments. I put very little money down on the vehicle nor did I trade anything for it (I bought it on an impulse) so I was never really prepared Financially for it. Had I put a decent down payment on it, or traded another vehicle on it, or maybe even leased it, having the Land Cruiser would not have been a problem. However I am glad to have an Expedition again, so I guess it all turn out for the good.

Ok, so let’s say hypothetically that my family and I did actually move to England, and I did bring my Expedition Limited along. There would be no where to take it Off-Road?

HYPNOTICALLY?