Subject: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
01/11/2008 @ 16:23:11: ingo: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
What's about the reliability of the Sebring? Chrysler always had a worst reputation (similar to Rover, Simca and Lada) also when it was bended with Mercedes Benz.

For me the costs of a car are important, sure, but I'm strongly looking on the reliability, even with the older, used cars, I always used to have. A car is only acceptable, when it runs for a lot of years and reaches a few hundred-thousands of kilometers without any breakdowns (and except of extraordinary service-works).
02/11/2008 @ 14:41:32: Germaneon: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Prejudice o not? I had a 1st gen Chrysler Neon for 5 years without breakdowns. A few minor issues fixed under warranty. Same with my current 2nd gen Neon. Meanwhile driving her for 8 years. Surely there are people with different experiences. But I also know a work mate which purchased a brand new Audi A4 Avant and that lemon spent more time with the mechanic than with my work mate. Yet I wouldn´t claim Audi as poor at all.
Take the Sebring for a test drive and find out whether it fits your needs and if yes try it.
02/11/2008 @ 15:12:47: garco: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Maybe I should take a test drive indeed. But first I have to find out if it runs on LPG (And if it does, if the leasecompany agrees on driving it on LPG...)
02/11/2008 @ 20:30:41: CarChasesFanatic: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
what's LPG?
02/11/2008 @ 21:36:07: ingo: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Liquid gas.
02/11/2008 @ 21:48:55: CarChasesFanatic: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
But which cars nowadays have that type of engine?
02/11/2008 @ 22:13:40: antp: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
The engine is the same as the petrol one, it is just that you have to add an extra tank and have the injection modified.
Some provide that as standard in the cars (Chevrolet ex-Daewoo, Lada, ...) but usually it is added later by the owner. It is more common in NL and BE I think.
02/11/2008 @ 22:43:03: ingo: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
And in the parts of Germany, which are close to NL and B, too. Up to 40 km distance from the border, you can say.

LPG is liquid gas, as Antoine said, you can mount it in nearly all petrol-cars.

The other, new version are engines with natural gas. Here you need special engines. These are quite rare, I remember, that the Fiat Multipla and the Opel Zafira are available with natural gas-engines. In Germany it was supported by the government with tax-lowerings.

It's a question for every single person, if a LPG-engine is senseful or not. The price per liter is much cheaper than Diesel, but outside of NL and B not everywhere available. And you must add the costs of the changing (and in Germany to need a technical permission of the TÜV, too).

As I've heard from my Dutch friends of the K 70-Club (yes, some in NL have LPG, too), the using of LPG costs 10% of the power and the consumption is 10% more than with petrol. And the engine runs a bit hotter.

And the LPG-tank needs space. Nowadays you mount in in the space of the spare-wheel, in the past you had you trunk full with this ugly big tank.

An anecdote at last: in 1996 I travelled illegally with a Dutch friend to the NSU-meeting in Southern Britain. Illegally, because at that time it was not allowed to use The Tunnel-train with LPG-cars (at some ferries it was forbidden, too, also in parking-garages). But we had hidden the two big LPG-tanks with our clothes. :wink:
This was the second illegal thing: this totally rotten K 70 had two big LPG-tanks in the trunk. Loaded with 52 liters of fuel and 100 liters of LPG we had entered the United Kingdom...
02/11/2008 @ 23:06:39: CarChasesFanatic: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Hmm thanks guys, but is it really worth buying a car that runs with that type of "fuel" ? converting the tank and all that stuff?
03/11/2008 @ 11:03:16: garco: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Yes, it's really worth it, 1 liter LPG costs 0,60 eurocent, unlueaded fuel is 1,30 euro...

I don't think it's worth it, when the car is 2nd hand...

Btw, car can run on both types of gas.
03/11/2008 @ 12:28:10: CarChasesFanatic: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Hmm thanks Garco, i don't think that's still common in here.
03/11/2008 @ 18:24:28: ingo: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
@garco: a Diesel-car is not attractive for you? It's in NL cheaper, even cheaper than in Germany (so thousands of German Diesel-car-drivers per day are going to Holland to fill up the tank, me sometimes, too).

I think, the popularity of LPG in the Netherlands is the fact, that unleaded fuel is so extreme expensive over there, much more than Diesel - and much more expensive than in the most other European countries except Britain and Norway.
03/11/2008 @ 20:30:20: garco: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Maybe diesel is cheaper, but diesel cars are much expensive then unleaded cars. Same Sebring for example is almost 26.000 euro's.

That's 3.000 more x 25% is much more tax...
03/11/2008 @ 20:59:08: antp: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
And the price difference of the fuel itself between diesel and unleaded is smaller than before.
I filled the tank of my car this evening:
0.98 for diesel
1.13 for euro95
(one of the cheapest price in Brussels, official price is higher)
03/11/2008 @ 21:39:36: garco: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
You filled your tank with diesel AND Euro95?
Your car still runs? :smile:
03/11/2008 @ 22:47:02: antp: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
never heard of hybrid cars? :ddr555:
(obviously I should have said "prices at the station where I filled the tank")
04/11/2008 @ 02:32:45: taxiguy: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Speaking of gas prices, the costs of gas is going down so much lately! It has literally gone down by half since the beginning of September. Every day the price has gone down more and more, a couple months ago it was over 4 dollars a gallon, now it's nearly down to under 2 dollars! (It was $2.18 when I checked today, and it'll be even lower tomorrow)

For the Europeans here:

2.18 dollars per gallon (the current price here) = 0.45 euros per liter

4 dollars per gallon (very very expensive) = 0.84 euros per liter
04/11/2008 @ 06:51:51: BlackIce_GTS: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Gas is coming down here, too. I think it peaked around 1.30$/L, down to .98 cents/L now.

Didn't see this post before:
Prejudice o not?

I'm very prejudiced; I love Mopar. The Sebring and the Avenger are awful cars though.
04/11/2008 @ 21:26:52: ingo: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
Just 2 hours ago I went with my neighbour to a LPG-station with his 1989 Passat 35i. This car has an old-style-LPG-tank, the big roll in the trunk.
At that station we talked with other LPG-drivers (by the way: LPG is cheaper in Germany than in Holland; today between 52 and 58 Cent over here, in NL over 60 Cent per liter).

These old big aftersales-market-tanks are usually bigger (up to 100 or 120 liters, but is costs a lot of space in hte trunk. The new style-tanks, made for the spare-tire-place aren't that small any more. In the past they had around 35 litzers, nowadays up to 80, 90 liters.

One LPG-car at the station this evening was a brand new BMW 330 si, the other a Citroen Berlingo and the next a Peugeot 206 CC Cabriolet. This one had an interesting construction. The trunk is too small for a regular LPG-tank, so the owner had (regularly) fixed a big spare-wheel-tank in the trunk, because its lower, low enough, that the open, folded roof can be stored over it. I didn't know, that the 206 CC originally had no spare tire at all! The guy told us, that some oweners, who wants to have a spare tire, have cutted a hole for it in a stabilisation-bar at the chassis' bottom. Very strange...

Anyways, my neighbour uses a LPG-systems since nearly 10 years. He drives 100 km per day to work and back. The conversion to LPG had cost in 1999 3900 D-Mark (ca.1800 Euro), correctly made by a specialist in Venlo/NL, with all German technical permissions.
He told me, that until now, driving with LPG had saved him around 9000 Euros in 9 1/2 years, compared with using fuel in his Passat.

I'll think about a LPG-car, if my Diesel-Omega will be gone sometimes.
04/11/2008 @ 21:32:34: ingo: 2008 Chrysler Sebring
P.S. @Max: be happy about your fuel-prices!
Yes, over here it's also much lower than a few weeks before. One hour ago I filled up Diesel for 1,23 Euro per liter.

Unfortunately I thought, when I stored my K 70 in the garage, with the thoughts, not to drive a lot in late atumn- and wintertime, "Let's fill up the tank. It will be more and more expensive". So I did in late September - for 1,64 Euro per liter 98 octane "Super plus" :sad:
Back